Persuasion Club

EP0012 04/05/26 - Cialdini on the Mount

• Kevin and Steven • Season 1 • Episode 12

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We've conquered the mountain! Join us for the explosive finale of our deep dive into Robert Cialdini's legendary book Influence: The Psychology of Persuasion. In this episode: Full recap of the 6 (now 7) core principles of influence Brand new game: "Who Wants to Be a Persuader?" — live persuasion trivia that will test your skills Epic after-show hangout with the crew Whether you're a persuasion novice or a seasoned influencer, this is your chance to level up. Don't miss it — the principles that move the world, delivered with laughs and lightning 

⚡ Tune in live or catch the replay. The power of "yes" starts here. 

#Cialdini #Influence #Persuasion #PersuasionClub #WhoWantsToBeAPersuader #Psychology #SelfImprovement #PersuasionPrinciple

SPEAKER_04

Government IT workers by day, verbal cage fighters, and persuasion enthusiasts the rest of the time. I said it backwards.

SPEAKER_02

Well, if you'd like to level up your persuasion game to godlike levels, grab your favorite stimulant, and prepare yourself for the persuasion hit of the day. It's the Persuasion Club Podcast. And it starts now. Yeah, baby.

SPEAKER_04

All right, this stuff is working so far today. That's good. Did that sound okay on your end? Uh audio-wise levels and all? Hopefully it did.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, if you're talking to me, it sounded sounded good on my end. Okay. Hope it sounds good for everybody else.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah. Somebody might uh if you're able to, I don't know, but keep an eye on the chat and see if there's anybody that pops in there and gives us any feedback throughout the show. Um, I don't see anybody in there now, but uh well anyway, hey, welcome everybody to the show. Um, we had a little uh as usual, it wouldn't be a show without some technical difficulties of some kind to start us off. So um yeah, that's true. Um I I could blame uh all kinds of things. I'll blame it on the interns, maybe. That's always a good one.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, the unpaid ones.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, they're all unpaid, man. Everybody around here is unpaid.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, we don't have paid interns either, so yeah.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah. Well, uh Steven, I heard you were um before the show uh talking about the yard work that you had to do today, but it was good probably get it outside actually and get some things done, break a sweat, clean some things up.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, it was like 76 degrees outside today, so it got a little warm and like there were clouds, like it's it it's freaking heat waves, but that's insane. Like in Oregon, like uh that's uh not unheard of, but it's not common. Um, and I'm kind of scared at what that means. How hot is it gonna be in August? You know, if it's 76 right now, yeah, yeah. It's just gonna ramp up for four months, it's gonna be pretty intense.

SPEAKER_04

And we didn't have the the near uh nasty winter that they told us that we were gonna have, so but um we'll we'll take what what uh what gets thrown at us uh for sure.

SPEAKER_02

I I don't think we got any snow that stuck this year.

SPEAKER_04

No, not we didn't I wanted to snow day, man. I have to go to work. But no. Well, hey folks, you're in for a show today. What it is, it's Easter, if you didn't know. Um, and of course, um Easter means that there's Easter eggs, right? Um so uh would might mention that uh this show is sprinkled with Easter eggs. So if you uh look throughout here and there, you may uh encounter one or two um in the show. So uh let us know if you do. Um put it uh post on X, comment on our show, um, let us know in the chat. Uh but anyway, we'll have a little bit of fun with it. Um, one of the first things that I wanted to do is uh because of the technology issues that we had last week, I really didn't feel like we were able to uh to do the proper uh tribute to Chuck Norris that I wanted to do. We we kind of flashed a picture of Chuck up there, but we didn't actually get to uh uh discuss um any of his persuasion um capabilities. Did you know that uh that Chuck was a persuasion enthusiast himself, Steve?

SPEAKER_02

I did not. I just thought I I knew that he is, you know, uh inhuman or you know, he's beyond uh human capabilities. So I I'm not surprised that he was good at persuasion, but uh heard that.

SPEAKER_04

Well, let's watch together.

SPEAKER_01

I think everything is great.

SPEAKER_04

That's where he ties it all together. Did you say I wasn't gonna fight?

SPEAKER_01

I didn't fight even a motivational seminar.

SPEAKER_04

A motivational seminar. See the reframe there? Man, yeah.

SPEAKER_02

That was crazy. That all happened at a restaurant? That is insane.

SPEAKER_04

What a what a scenario. Yeah, well, you know, it's Delta Force, it's uh it's a movie, of course, but uh oh, I haven't I have not seen that. Oh, yeah, that's a vocal good old Chuck Norris movie. Yeah, so but um I don't know, maybe he's done that kind of thing in real life. I'd um would put it past him. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. That's great. Um, so now that we've gotten our proper uh tribute to Chuck Norris um uh out of the way, uh rest in peace, Chuck Norris. We will miss you uh greatly. Um we could actually go ahead and uh do what we um uh meant to do here, which was recap our uh chapter, or not our chapter, but our whole uh book. We we finished it.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, that's crazy. It's crazy how the book is uh the book is like we've gone through it. I it felt like it was gonna take at least a year. Uh so you know, just 12 weeks, uh that's not too bad.

SPEAKER_04

Um, I think the overall book, um, if I'm recalling correctly, is nine chapters. And we were kind of discussing this a little bit but before the show. Uh and by the way, folks, we're talking about the book Influence um by Robert Sceldini. Um, thank you, Steve. You oh, you disappeared. Oh, there you go.

SPEAKER_02

Whoa, it made the whole screen disappear. Yeah. Screen doesn't like that thing.

SPEAKER_04

I didn't um throw that slide up in um my deck here today, but that's uh perfect that you had the book. It's Robert Caldini. We did uh this chill, uh, I think it's kind of how we um figured out is how we will refer to the the master of persuasion there. So um and that influence book is uh as we kind of mentioned in our early episodes, was um what kind of what we found on our own separately when we had first started to think about like what kind of books we might read about persuasion, it just seemed like every road kind of led to there, you know.

SPEAKER_02

So from different sources.

SPEAKER_04

It just kind of all worked out, yeah. So uh whether it's uh his marketing um and or his persuasion, um, Robert Chialdini is the the name that comes up more than any other name, more than even Scott Adams, really, because um I don't think that a lot of people would even know per se that Scott uh Adams was a uh persuasion enthusiast uh himself. But uh anyway, um the the the whole uh chapter uh layout that we were talking about before the show is that you get an intro um basically in chapter one, and then it's in chapter two that he dives into reciprocity and then through the rest of them. And um, I think that I'll play as another uh kind of fun video here see if you recognize Mr. Sheldini. The seven principles of persuasion.

SPEAKER_01

What the hell did you do that for?

SPEAKER_04

Oh fuck. Now what am I supposed to do? You're like, what'd you do, Kevin? Moses Chiodini. Moses Chioldini. Yeah. Oh, that I had uh a joke the other day. I've got to do it. It's like a dad joke, but if you were to put uh Ozzy Osbourne and Moses together, would you have Osmosis? Um okay, bad joke, bad joke. Solid dad joke. Solid dad joke, yeah. Um that uh of course was uh a doctor that wasn't the real Moses or the real Robert Sheldini, that was a um a mashup, if you will. Um, and if you noticed on the scroll or the tablets there that it was six and then scratched out seven principles. So what you may uh not know, and here's a little factoid, is that if you have the older edition of the influence book, then you would only get six of the principles because um they're at one time was were only six. And someone even asked Chialdini if why do you you know think about maybe expanding that list a little bit? And he's like, No, I think everything kind of wraps up nicely into six, you know. And then one day he he felt that he had found like a hidden kind of seventh one in there that um kind of stands on its own. So, and that was the Unity chapter that we were talking about last week, and um, that we didn't get to play all of our videos for. So, guess what? We get to do that tonight. We get to make up for what we didn't uh get to to play uh last week. And so tonight, while we we will definitely go through all of the different principles, um, we'll probably camp out a little bit more in Unity again um and just kind of show you a few uh funny videos that go uh perfectly. Uh I think with uh I found a couple new ones too. Yeah, what I what do you got to do?

SPEAKER_02

Sounds good.

SPEAKER_04

So like a good wrap-up for or like a good uh plan for tonight, Steve. And then tonight we will also play a little bit more of America's new favorite game, Who Wants to be a Persuader. Uh so lock in, everybody. Thank you for that. Um right, uh well, the first, and we'll go into back into presentation mode here. The the first chapter that we talked about, and um, or not chapter, I should say, but the first principle is this one here. Sometimes I hate the fact that this version of Rumble Studio covers up the video or the thing that you're trying to show. Um, so I know that people, if you're looking at this, you're probably going, well, gosh, you guys ugly mugs or so. I'll turn off my video for a second here, Steve and you want to as well. I think people can still hear us, right? Should be, yeah, I can hear you. Okay, perfect. So um, and that's you know, we could just show that um let people read that there. That uh the principle of reciprocity essentially is that people feel obligated uh to give back to others when they receive something first. So I'm gonna go turn my video back on here. Come on, camera, there. And then oh hey. There we go. Did you see that? Uh that Chroma cam was yours, I hope that but I installed that piece off of my system.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04

But anyway, um, so that have you noticed yourself now that we've learned and discussed that principle on our show, how much we kind of uh are doing at that in real life?

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, yeah, it's uh it's a lot. Yes, I have noticed quite a bit. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04

Well, what uh what I kind of uh I I just not really necessarily paying attention, but it in uh then things happen in life where you kind of see that uh principle happening in action, whether you're really even trying to or not. It just um is kind of uh the human condition, uh, if you will, in a way that people um will um feel that kind of sense of obligation uh that uh if you give them something that they somehow need to return to favor, it just kind of built in.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, definitely.

SPEAKER_04

And so um reciprocity, uh, we camped in that chapter for about two episodes and talking about different uh facets of that. Um, you can learn more about that in in our previous episodes as well. Um, did you have anything you wanted else to say about reciprocity before we um move on to the next one?

SPEAKER_02

Or uh I guess if for me it just comes down to a lot of this actually, maybe this applies to all the principles, but it takes a lot of intention, it takes a lot of like thinking about things and being being intentional. So you know, sometimes people will randomly tell you that you have to be more intentional. This is one of those times where I feel like taking each of these principles and like making sure that you're trying to keep it on the front of your mind and and like uh look for those opportunities where you can apply them. That to me has been something that especially with like reciprocation, it's like, oh, okay, like I need to be intentional about uh making sure you know, uh thinking about situations either that I'm putting myself in or other people might be putting me in. And how do I want to respond? Do I want to reciprocate? Is this something that I want to like give back as well? And so there's a lot of that that I've that going through my mind lately out there in the real world.

SPEAKER_04

So that's and that uh clearly uh actually aligns um for folks that may not be entirely aware that Steven and I work um in the same uh um office um in the same department. Um, we're government IT workers, as we say. Um, and uh they have us work on things that help us build our skill sets, our talent stacks, so to speak. Um, and one of those this year, or uh it's been that this intentional engagement thing. And so persuasion actually really uh ties hand in hand with intentional engagement. You can't not uh be in the I don't want to say the business of persuasion, but just you can't be a persuader um if you don't at least understand a little bit about how um that intentional engagement uh worked. You you're never gonna get um persuade if you're not engaging, I guess is what I'm trying to say.

SPEAKER_02

So um yeah, you'll be the person that everyone's like, Did you get did you see how it worked on him? Yeah, right. Uh you don't you don't want to, I mean, not that that's a bad place to be, because anyone who's doing any sort of persuasion should have the best intention. Speaking of being intentional, so you know but but if you're not thinking, you're just that person that's being persuaded constantly one way or the other, and and that can be dangerous because if you get online and you're easily persuaded, then there's a lot out there online that can persuade you to like very dark places. Just be thoughtful, be intentional.

SPEAKER_03

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_04

Uh that's even yeah, being intentional as a warning, that's a good one. Um, that sometimes uh we we have to not only be intentional about like how we reach out and um uh and communicate with others, but like how it is that we're receiving in and taking in things um very much. Um that's a good point.

SPEAKER_02

So yeah, I I know I can get pretty tilted out there when I read too much and it and I'm reading things that might frustrate me. It's like, oh, I can I can feel the toxicity creeping up. I need to suppress the toxicity. So uh, you know, you have to be able to know your limits and know when to kind of back away. And for me, that's pretty quickly. Yeah, I have to be careful.

SPEAKER_04

So yeah. Well, I definitely um we'll just add on to the end of the reciprocity topic that um I think the the graphic that we have here uh in a way is a little bit misleading because it shows uh someone giving a gift and giving an item um a tangible thing um to another. And that's certainly one form of reciprocity. And I don't know how visually uh you would be able to uh even communicate reciprocity in another way, but even just uh in the way that your interactions with people, um uh if you ask others about themselves and um even ask probing questions about themselves that get them to talk to you about their lives and stuff like that, so that you're showing interest. And it helps if you're genuine, but if you can't be genuine, then you know at least learn how to um speak and talk in a way uh that makes people feel like you're taking uh an interest in them, right? You know, and um that kind of thing will get people to open up to you in a way that sometimes um no gift will be able to do. So um if you show a genuine interest, uh I think that people know when you're being genuine and and when you're not.

SPEAKER_02

So and even now AI is good at taking genuine interest in you. If you if you talk with AI, they oh, you know, tell me more. Oh, that what a great idea. You know, even AI has it figured out. Oh yeah, you know, compliment people, tell them something nice about themselves or that something they did, draw that out, genuine, like you said. But like uh, you know, but a compliment goes a long way. And if you're trying to form a relationship or a bond or maybe even you know, an outcome, then like you know, it it doesn't take that much effort to say, hey, nice haircut, or hey, nice watch. It doesn't even just like you know, find something. If you can't find something, I think maybe you know, take a while, look inside of yourself really deeply and and figure out like hey, okay, why can I not find any way to compliment anyone, even if it was forced?

SPEAKER_04

Nice uh wooden leg you've got going on there, yeah.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, and the and the parrot on your shoulders lovely parrot.

SPEAKER_04

Okay, um that's reciprocity. Um, do you uh just as a persuasion trivia high um um preview, do you know what comes after reciprocity?

SPEAKER_02

I do because I might be looking at it, but I think it's liking. Is it?

SPEAKER_04

Um I must have it out of order then, but that's all right. We'll do liking.

SPEAKER_02

That's what that's what I just said.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, no, I I had it in a different order, but I might have had it wrong. So that's okay. Uh liking is just fine. I'm gonna turn off my camera for a second. Magic. Am I magic? Yep. Okay, there you go. People. Now you read this one, Steven. I read the last one.

SPEAKER_02

People are more easily persuaded by those they like through similarity, compliments, attractiveness, or shared interest.

SPEAKER_04

So um, I'll go ahead and turn the camera back. Oh no, this is the way we've got to do it for now until we get our handy-dandy um nifty new software that I'm working on. So yeah, that'll be cool. Yeah. Uh how have you ever noticed that you have been more uh biased towards uh the things that uh people that you like are uh I don't know how that's maybe not the framing of the question uh that I meant to say, but do you do you ever notice yourself um being drawn to things that you know that other people like or that they've talked about or whatever?

SPEAKER_02

Uh I no, I haven't never I have not noticed an increase, but I do naturally I I do naturally like when I hear someone like something, like naturally I start asking them usually questions about that thing, because like I probably don't know much about it, and it's you know, it it could be an easy way to learn about it if the person here interested just tells me what they think, and you know, then I can go research it. So I do find myself like naturally doing that, but I have not noticed an increase, um, although I'm way more aware of it.

SPEAKER_04

It's probably because we're not celebrities or whatever, but I think if I remember in this episode that um we that might have been the night that we did the Super Bowl um show. Um, so we we pulled up some of the old Super Bowl commercials like with Betty White and the Snickers, um, the Bud Weiser, um, and the guys, you know, hey, or what's up, you know, and uh yeah. And that was all about um that that liking thing in the sense that um we we tend to be drawn to and like the things that we see that other people like. Um or if if there's a person um that we like um then And we're gonna be more uh persuaded by um that person than if we didn't like them. And that makes perfect sense.

SPEAKER_02

So yeah, that does. And I I feel like uh it makes sense that generally you end up being friends with or surrounding yourself with people who like similar things. Um because that it's it's kind of a more natural form of reciprocation, but yeah, it it is like very natural to like find and try to hang out with people that are like you uh or like the things that you like. Uh, because that instantly, whether it's like church or a hobby, that builds in an in an immediate like connection with that person or those people if it's a group.

SPEAKER_04

So I um I one of the things that I'm recalling now is I've kind of like thinking about that whole chapter, is that there was some data, and I don't recall exactly what that data was, about how um it would present some kind of a fact or something to somebody. Um, and the survey basically was measuring the response to how people would uh how people or how many would respond favorably towards something just if a regular person did it. Um and then they would come back through again and say, okay, well, this time uh George Clooney says the very same thing. So you know it's basically the big difference between if I said something or you said something versus a celebrity or whatever, and it just skyrocketed, you know, the the the response and how people you know either believed it or responded to it or whatever. So uh you think about it as like liking has almost a lot to do with authority, which is one of our other you know, chapters, and then liking is also kind of like unity, uh, because people in in groups tend to respond to things. So there's a lot of uh kind of parallels between the two principles, I think.

SPEAKER_02

Definitely, yeah. There's some blending. Uh it's hard to separate them completely, especially when you when you can read the matrix all of a sudden, and oh, the green screen with the letters makes sense, and I the fourth wall.

SPEAKER_04

I will tell you, uh, it's kind of funny because now sometimes when I'm talking with somebody, uh my wife and daughter were talking about something earlier, and I was like, Oh, okay, well, that's this persuasion technique and this one here, you know. It's like, or or even the uh what do we call them logical argument fallacies that we've been talking about, uh that go kind of hand in hand with these. Um, so yeah, it's this chapter.

SPEAKER_02

Which chapter was the straw man?

SPEAKER_04

Oh, I don't remember which one we did the straw man.

SPEAKER_02

Social proof or liking anyway. I since we've talked about the straw man theory, it's everywhere. Yeah, it's so prevalent out there where someone gives an opinion and the person attacks the person instead of the opinion. You know, there's no like discourse back and forth, it's just mostly like, oh, you have an opinion I don't like, I hate you. Yeah, you suck, yeah. It's like, whoa, whoa, calm down.

SPEAKER_04

Your brother wears combat boots and drives a purple beer truck, man. You know, dude, it's crazy.

SPEAKER_02

It's crazy how quickly people are just like you, they take it to a personal level, like beyond the opinion and beyond just a normal conversation. It's like, are you like this in real life? It would be impossible to deal with if this was in real life. But online, especially, people feel like they can take it to a very personal level when they're when they're typing on a keyboard, as opposed to like in real life, it would never act that way. So there is a there is a difference in you know how it's communicated.

SPEAKER_04

There was um funny you should mention that in being online and a straw man, as a matter of fact, there was somebody of somebody I actually knew that had um basically um it was a deflection, so there's a straw man, but then there was also uh an appeal to uh emotion uh fallacy. Um, and I won't go into the details of what uh this person was talking about, but there was I caught two logical argument fallacies all in uh in the same comment on a on a thread. And um, and I didn't the person may not have actually even necessarily been wrong, but that failed to address the actual point that the that the original poster had been making. And so I was just like, hey, nice straw man, man, appeal to emotion there, you know. Of course, I got a snarky reply back, but yeah, you're probably right though. We have noticed, I've noticed, it sounds like you've noticed that once we start talking about these things more, then they just kind of we get pervasive. We we we notice them uh when we see them.

SPEAKER_02

Definitely and and and I I've kind of noticed, I've kind of like started to be able to point, uh notice that more, and then also as soon as I notice that, I pretty much my view of that person also kind of changes. And granted, I don't often know these people, but instead of just being like, hey, you're a normal online, friendly person, or I guess maybe that's not normal, but you're friendly and online, all of a sudden it's like, whoa, you take things to a personal level unnecessarily, and that is not a good trait to have. So uh it does kind of once you start noticing it, you start to see the the the problem with it as well, which is good. People should be more aware of how often this happens and be able to like uh step back and say, hey, even if I like the person who's who's performing the straw man effect, you know, uh I I should maybe think about like how much I listen to that, uh, because this isn't you know a way to behave or even how do you any situation how do you draw their attention to it in um in a way that's both persuasive but also um where they don't even know it, more hypnotic, maybe some yeah, yeah. I don't know. It's just trying to again, you gotta be intentional and kind of aware. So it yeah, uh it's hard to do sometimes, honestly.

SPEAKER_04

It is, yeah. You only get better with practice. Um, well, liking um what uh what comes next?

SPEAKER_02

Uh to my uh uh chapter four is social proof.

SPEAKER_04

Social proof. All right, we're just gonna do it in the order that you got it. So um, and I don't think we need to camera off for this one, it's right there for us. People look to the actions of others to guide their own behavior. Everybody's doing it. Sounds familiar. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, it's um um the the classic. Um, well, everybody's doing it, mom. All the all the all the kids at school are smoking weed.

SPEAKER_02

No, I'm they jump, they jumped off the club.

SPEAKER_04

Well, mom, you know, let me yeah. Um but uh the examples that we see in the slide, customer reviews um are one way that social proof works. Um, it works on me. Um when I go on Amazon and I'm looking for stuff, I'll you know, I'll I'll pick the things that have the best, you know, the number of stars, um, the best reviews, those kinds of things.

SPEAKER_02

How many reviews is a big one too? Like, oh, 3,000 people said 4.6 overall, so it must be great, you know.

SPEAKER_04

Whereas uh four out of five dentists is like, well, you can only come up with five. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02

So you're telling me in a group of 20, there's four that don't like that's crazy.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, give me the give me the big numbers, man. Yeah, that's uh that's true. The most popular, of course, you know, anything that's um uh recommended. Um these are the kinds of things that you see all the time, even like you were saying the number. Um, so that example on the right of the 800k followers, you know, we're versus um either no big deal. Yeah, yeah. We're we're drawn to things that other people are are drawn to. So um that uh social proof works really well.

SPEAKER_02

Um you know, I I fell into uh there's people online, all sorts of people sell stuff, and like, you know, they'll advertise different things. And there's been several times where I've purchased something because of a content creator per you know advertised it. So like uh I used to drink a lot of monster energy drinks, and uh there was a content creator whoa, excuse me. Uh there was a content creator or is named PewDiePie who was like, uh, this G-fuel, it's a powder that you add to water. And uh so I started drinking that for like years, like three or four or five years. I drank G Fuel. And uh because this guy like said, like, hey, it's uh it's it's good, like it, you know, here's the ingredients or whatever, but like um I was like, well, it's gotta be better than monster if I'm just adding a tiny little spoonful to uh you know 20 ounces of water. Um, you know, anyway, so you're drinking most of the that was like a moment where I was like, Oh, well, if this guy likes it, you know, maybe I should give it a shot. And I did for a long time. So anyway, so I've I've been ducked into a few social proof uh persuasion persuasions.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, it was kind of funny. Um, in the last chapter uh of the Chaldini's wrap-up, he was talking about uh somebody who was using a persuasion technique on him, and that he knew even that that technique was being used on him and and allowed it. So it even uh even the masters you know are are subject to uh being persuaded in in some fashion because that's life. Life is persuasion.

SPEAKER_02

So it's like chess, it's like, okay, I know that like you just took my queen, but like I still gotta keep going and take your you know, it's like there's moves that you have to always kind of be thinking ahead, and reciprocity is a big one. Like it's like, okay, I know that I'm in a moment that where I need to reciprocate, or I know that I just created a moment where they need to reciprocate. Like uh, but that especially like with business or work, that can be really, really normal.

SPEAKER_04

Absolutely. Yeah. Well, um, we could go more into social proof, but we've already done that in uh previous shows, so we're gonna kind of keep it moving here um so that we can get on to playing some game. Uh, what is our next uh one after that, Steven?

SPEAKER_02

After uh after social proof was authority, chapter three.

SPEAKER_04

Oh, I uh I like this slide. Remember that? Yeah, yeah, man. We um people, oh you you that's your turn.

SPEAKER_02

You read people tend to follow the lead of credible, knowledgeable experts or authority figure.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, I mean that's true. Uh and all it takes is somebody with a badge, somebody in a suit, uh, somebody something, um a lot of visual um kinds of ways, but I think there are other ways in which people can exert authority um such that uh even getting big groups of people to do things, you know, it's crazy.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, I was just uh I I am somewhat invested into Nike as a company and uh like stock wise or you know, whatever. So uh they uh they changed CEOs in the last year because their stock price was just like diving. And uh but it was you know, the the previous CEO that they had was very came across as like the authority on like the digital marketplace, like he came from a digital background and oh really like digital, like e-commerce, like it was a big push. Like we need to get out of stores like Macy's and we need to go directly to online and like sell through online retailers and like prioritize them. And that is kind of backfiring now. But like I was gonna say, how's that working out for them? But yeah, not not great, it's really, really bad. And like the stock price uh in the last couple years has just like continued to kind of nosedive. So it's like uh, but you had a CEO who you trusted to run the company, they they came across as the authority on something, and it just didn't quite turn out right. But he got quite a bit of people uh to follow him, and that may not have you know necessarily worked out at you know, as we can see, stock price usually reflects the health of the company, not always, but like um it it's been pretty bad. So they changed the leadership and they they've been doing that for a long time, and you can see like it's not turning around as quickly, I'm sure, as people hope. But uh man, the a CEO being the authority of something can really do a really good thing or like take the business to a really dark, bad spot. So uh people can be misled, but hey, it's like they're the authority, they're being persuasive. I need to follow them, and then you you end up, you know, like the dodo birds in Ice Age, they're like, Oh, that guy jumped off the cliff, I'm just gonna all jump off, and they all jump off the cliff or whatever. Yeah, well, there go the dodo birds, you know. I thought of another point. That's what I was thinking.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, yeah, that's a really good example, actually. Um, and I'll add on another one that uh in a similar vein, kind of talking about past lives and places uh um for me. This was a place of employment. I used to work for Symantec Corporation, and uh Symantec um was known for a lot of things, but one of the things they were also uh mostly known for was their antivirus software. Um, but their antivirus software was Norton, yeah. And so Symantec Symantec acquired Norton. And um, so while he was out on a beach uh drinking you know drinks with little you know umbrellas in them and stuff like that, semantic was marketing with you know, it was Norton antivirus, and you know, he'd be on the box covers, you know, just you know, looking all authoritative, you know, and you would look at that box cover and it's like that man knows his shit, you know. I want that, you know. So uh very much how that works. It's like you know, you people know the name, so it was Norton Antivirus, um, even though that guy had long retired.

SPEAKER_02

So that's it's funny. I wonder because the other one was named like McAfee. There was McAfee Antivirus and Norton. It was like, was there another one named after another guy? Like it's like, why are we antivirus? Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. It's kind of funny. Uh but yeah, Norton, Norton always came like preloaded with most computers that were sold, like at like Best Buy, things like that. And uh I always uninstalled it as quickly as I could, which sometimes you had to you had to download a different program to uninstall it. It was like that embedded in your computer.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, if it was part of like the distribution, like uh sometimes uh the image that they would put on the computers would just have all that stuff baked in and stuff, so yeah, and then you'd have to try to get off of your computer that you just couldn't do it without like tools and stuff like that. Crazy stuff, yeah. Um, but anyway, authority. Um that uh in a nutshell is uh um the way that authority works, uh, we just kind of tend to to look up to and and believe, and that's even a warning sign in and of itself, um, because we shouldn't always believe everybody that appears to be an authority, and we've seen how that can can backfire.

SPEAKER_02

So yeah, where some people say question everything, but uh sometimes uh when someone seems the authority on something, it's like well, questioning that seems stupid. I'm gonna go with them. Yeah. So uh yeah, you can be easily persuaded. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, I I uh think about it as like uh all the time, we're always gonna be challenged by that because there's just always gonna be some like the people in the white lab coats, you know, when you go to the doctor, it's like anybody in a white lab coat to me is somebody in authority because they they know more than I do.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, they went to school for that. I did not.

SPEAKER_04

So uh well, let's see. After authority, then uh then we have uh what's the next one?

SPEAKER_02

Then chapter six comes scarcity, scarcity.

SPEAKER_04

Uh-huh. So um examples here, the only one left. Um, did you read last one? I think you did. I'll read this one. Um, opportunities appear more valuable when they are less available. Boy, that ain't that the truth. So um the the recap uh actually uh that Chaldini did at the end of the book, I think actually was uh a scarcity thing where he was talking about um going to Best Buy. And when he he found a pretty good television for a really good price, and he's just like, yeah, that's you know, and he knew, and the the salesperson came over and said, Yeah, that's that's a very good uh set for that price. Um the problem is that's the last one I've got. So that's the one that Cialdini knew he was being like, okay, somebody's using the scarcity principle on me, right? You know, yeah. So and he knew it. He knew it. He says, I knew that was happening, but he went ahead because what if he were wrong? What if he were wrong and he didn't buy the TV and then came back later to buy it and it was gone, you know? And so he he bought the TV. But you know what else he did? He's like, he's like, well, he he the curiosity was killing him, so he went back the next day to see if there was another one that was up there in its place. Um, it turns out the guy wasn't BSing him. Um, there wasn't it was the last television, but uh how often? Um, and I think that um he even mentioned that Best Buy had um a lawsuit filed against them um because they had at one time, I think back in I want to say 2006, maybe 2009, um, they were doing exactly that. Um, they they would just say that this is the last one, and then you know, when they had more in the back.

SPEAKER_02

So that's so slimy. It is that's that's yeah, that's terrible.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah. So if if you're a person who needs to persuade for a living, um be be at least ethical uh and don't lie. You can still uh use the scarcity principle um without necessarily being unethical about it, I think.

SPEAKER_02

So yeah, I think it that the scarcity one gets kind of like uh to the auspicious zone where it's like how how you apply this, it can really come across as like dirty salesman or like authentic, uh you know, helpful person, like how you apply this one can be ethical or a little less ethical, probably if you're if you're get if you're in a car salesman kind of position where you're just trying to make a sale because like you it's been a bad day. So uh yeah.

SPEAKER_04

The uh funny thing um Steven and I have noticed about is we talk about persuasion, it's come up a lot on the show. Um it always comes down to the car salesman, doesn't it?

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, they they they practice their their whole job is persuasion, but I yeah, you know, last time I bought a car, I I went in knowing the car that I wanted, and um and they kind of said a several things and and tried to like be really nice and figure out like what it what am I interested in and all this kind of stuff. And I kind of knew it the whole time, but I was like, dude, I I want this car, like I yes, like I'm here because I did my research. And I think I may have said that at some point, but uh that guy just kept trying to play me like a fiddle, and I was like, dude, I like I want this car, like you don't even have to work for it, dude. Just shut up and take my money. Just be lucky that you're the guy that's talking to me because like I'm gonna buy this thing.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, so um maybe he just felt like he was kind of had to make sure he was locking you because well, not necessarily locking you in, but um, I believe that a lot of those salespeople are taught uh how to do things in a certain sequential order, and so they they're like doing all of the going through the motions, I think is the way they yeah, yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_02

Like they have tactics in their head and they kind of have like a timer, like okay, that one didn't work, try the next one. But they have like an order, you know, because we did walk by a couple cars and he's like, That's a really nice one. Like that that price is crazy, like, yeah, yeah, I'm not interested. But it was like uh he he did try a few things, and I was just like, like, yeah, you you can calm down. Like, I I want this.

SPEAKER_04

They probably like us. Yeah, yeah, either that or they see as a challenges, you know, see if we can upsell, you know.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, exactly. Like, I'm I'm like lowballing something and they're trying to get more out of me. But uh yeah, so you don't want to tell them that you're there intentionally too much, because then they'll yeah, they'll they'll switch, they'll skip a few steps and start pressuring you. So uh but it's all pressure, so it's it is meant to be, but very much is, yeah.

SPEAKER_04

So scarcity, we did a really great episode about that one. I think that was one that we called like one of our uh better episodes. So uh definitely go back and check that one out uh if you want to know more about how that one works. Um, what else then? Um after scarcity comes commitment and consistency, all right. Commitment and consistency. Um, so that was uh the graphic uh kind of I enjoyed kind of making this one here. Um remember we We we talked about how it started out with um somebody coming to the door and saying, um, would you mind putting a small sign in your window? And when it's something a small favor, a small ask, uh something like that, um people um will uh respond to that over a larger ask. Um so sometimes you could start with a small ask. So, like in in our graphic here, um, you can see a little sign in the window there. Trying to remember what it says. I think it says free hugs. So yeah, yeah. Um I think that was uh the the AI made that up, but I thought it was nice. I liked it. Free hugs, you know. So and you see, see the little check mark next to that. Uh so it's like free hugs, little sign in the window, check mark. That's number one. Okay. Then a couple weeks later, you come back and ask, Can I put a larger sign in your yard? Um, you know, well, people like to remain consistent, and that's actually the other part of the slide. I was actually just saying that out loud and not even reading the slide, but that's actually what it says. People like to be consistent with their previous commitments and self-image. So they feel good about putting the little sign in the window. Um, then it's harder to say no when you come along and ask if you can put the larger sign at the yard. So in this particular case, um, the next ask was the the next the vote yes sign in the yard, right? So um, and then just to demonstrate the principle uh a little bit further, then a few weeks later, same person comes along. You've already put the larger sign um in the yard and the smaller sign in the window, so let's just put a big old banner up in the yard. So saying yes to everything, even the neighbor's cat sitting on my lawn. So yeah, but I would imagine that uh you've uh had uh experiences like that or know of other people who um are that way where they are very true to their image um and trying to bring together. Yes, sometimes.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, it's like a you can this can either be a really good thing to have commitment and consistency and like behave that way, or it can be, you know, depending on what path you end up going down, it can because like um I I know people that like they said they started, you know, giving two dollars or oh it looks like my audio is like clipping.

SPEAKER_04

I I hear you just fine, but okay.

SPEAKER_02

Uh so like uh people will uh donate like two dollars a month to support like a kid in another country or a family in another country, and it this provides you know their meals for however many days or weeks. And and I know a lot of people that have started out donating that way, and then eventually they're like, uh, you know, there's also these other things that you can give to these other causes, it's just like two or three more dollars, but then you can feed like a village, and it's like, oh uh, okay, it's just two or three more dollars. And it's a good thing, but uh eventually, you know, it if you're it gets to a point where you're giving away or like you join a church and they're like, Hey, welcome. Now we need 10% of your income. Now you're tithing to a church. It's just like uh everyone's a volunteer. Yeah, they let you get in the door and then they're like, Well, this person's willing to give us something, maybe we should ask for more. And then, you know, if it's not that much more, you you do it like uh uh Disney Plus keeps raising their subscription cost every month, and I keep paying it, but like I'm a I need to stop. Um but it it's like uh yeah, just a tiny bit more. Why not? They're already paying thirty dollars a month.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, and I I think the the we've talked uh uh about this the principle, the slow uh slow boiling of the frog um is kind of at play there. So um just keep turning that heat up a little bit more, raise that price up a little bit more, tiny little bit, you don't even know what's happening.

SPEAKER_02

So yeah, yeah, I feel like um uh McDonald's did that recently. I haven't eaten at McDonald's for like three weeks now. You gotta be shitting me. They upset me so much because they keep raising their prices by like they keep rising them by like five to fifteen. It depends on the item, but man, I've been I eat there enough, and uh over the last two years it's been like I yeah, it's like I dude, I buy this thing three times a week. Like you keep raising the price on me, so it's just gotten to a point where I'm like, I'm gonna stop eating there. Like, but but there's other problems that cause that. I mean, uh, they're like paying you know twenty dollars for minimum wage or whatever, so there's other factors that are leading into like uh rising costs, but yeah, I wish I understood that.

SPEAKER_04

We might uh pick that topic up a little more. I have some things to say about that. Maybe we'll talk about that in our after show, right? Okay, okay, cool, cool, cool. Well, because yeah, it's definitely like uh take out a second mortgage to go and eat sometimes. It's what I was saying to my friends the other day up at the uh the Satch show. Uh, for anybody wondering what the Satch show is, that's Joe Satriani, Steve I uh got to see those two Thursday night. Oh man, they were awesome. So um legends, legends, yes, guitar gods, right? Like if you want to be a persuasion god, that's one thing. A guitar god, um, you that those are guitar gods. Um, I digress. Uh let's go ahead and um we've got so I think that was six, right? We looked through the six.

SPEAKER_02

Uh so that was chapter, oh wait, we just that was consistency, that was six principles, but chapter seven. So now chapter eight is the seventh principle.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, so that was being added. Unity. Uh yeah. So there we go. Um, Unity. This is gonna be the chapter that we'll camp on just a little bit here. I've got enough videos that we probably don't even need to talk about it too much, but um, I guess we have to turn our videos off for to read this one. So I gotta do that real quick. Um, Unity. We are more likely to be influenced by those with whom we identify and feel connected or share a sense of we. So now turn the cameras back on. There we go. So um did say I'd throw in a few Easter eggs uh uh into the the thing. I don't know if you spot uh the special guests in in our slide or not.

SPEAKER_02

So uh yeah, I see Dara.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, and Dara didn't even know he's gonna be on the old Jackson from uh well from um Pulp Fiction John Trivolta. Yeah, so I have to laugh at this one, but I am asking AI to generate um images, and so it generated this this image you know, of just other people, nobody else. I'm like, okay, well, change this person to me, change that person to Steve, you know, so you're the guy on the right. Although you kind of look a little like Charlie Kirk there, I don't know why, but anyway. Uh like but that's it really thinned me out. Yeah, I'll say that's so that's you on the right. Of course, you're right there next to Scott Adams. Um, I don't know if you recognize the woman, she's that happy to be there, but uh the potential other president, and and what what made me put that in there is funny because I just know that uh Scott would always talk about Kamala being a drunk, and so it's just like she just looks really unhappy to be there, so but uh in the original image, AI, of course, had to put in the token black guy, and so it was like a token black guy. Well, it's like if you're gonna do a token black guy, you might as well do it in style, man. So Samuel Jackson Jackson. So but uh yeah, there's that's the unity principle, uh, essentially, um, that sense of belonging, um, when you're with people that you know, um, and stuff like that, then uh your your influence is stronger. Um, their influence of others is stronger with you, your influence on them just as strong, so or can be. I have a couple of videos if we wanted to watch those.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, let's see it. Sorry, I just kind of spaced out thinking about unity. Unity, yeah.

SPEAKER_04

And these crazy people in the in Kevin's slide, right?

SPEAKER_02

Um what a crazy group of uh yeah.

SPEAKER_04

Um, it was just a funny. I had to go kind of funny with it.

SPEAKER_02

I don't hear the audio.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, you know, we kind of had that problem with this one the other night. I wonder if it's not a problem with uh maybe it's more of a problem. Yeah, it it wants to play, it just doesn't seem to be playing. Well, the ones that were playing well for me earlier, um, so this is the example of no Unity. Try this. And we're still getting no audio up.

unknown

That point.

SPEAKER_02

How weird. Oh, it started. It's just it was super delayed, I think.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, well, it's very possible. Yeah. Why is that that later on we tend to run into that issue where uh like as we get into the podcast, things tend to slow down a little bit. So uh I'm gonna try this. I'm gonna try this again and and hope that it works out. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03

I must still see that now.

SPEAKER_04

The audio is off.

SPEAKER_02

That's a little off, but Leslie Nielsen though.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah. I'm gonna turn it off here because it kind of screwed up if it's not gonna play um and and sync up correctly there. Um, and that really disappoints me because it was also one of the other things that I had tested before the show. So yeah, um I'm gonna try one more here and see what happens. So or try it again. But it recrossed. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Why, why, why?

SPEAKER_04

Yeah. I would say the audio is almost like 10 seconds off, but uh one.

SPEAKER_02

It must be on Teams called.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, yeah, no kidding, right? Well, and if I go and I look at my task manager right now, I'll probably see like um well, only 41% CPU being used up. Um, but I don't know. It just seems to get weird when we get further into a show sometimes, and things that worked earlier don't it's probably just because more resources are being consumed by things like studio and stuff like that. So um, hey, but we got our Chuck Norris video earlier, that worked out pretty well, I thought.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, yeah, it yeah, it I can't believe I haven't seen that movie. So uh I'm gonna have to go watch that.

SPEAKER_04

The um I was listening to, and speaking of just technical issues, real quick, uh, one of the things that um made me feel good is and uh no no slight at all to this, but I noticed in even the school Scott Adams was trying to use Rumble Studio the other day to play some videos, and the host uh Erica was having a tough time seeing the video herself. She would be playing videos and not seeing them, but other people could see them. So um weird. It's yeah, it's just kind of a strange uh kind of an issue that I think um I I if I had a handle on it, I would obviously uh have it fixed and we wouldn't have the problem. So um I spend, like I said, several hours earlier today trying to get those to work. Um so I think that we could go ahead and call it good. Uh, we've done a wrap-up through the the different topics, didn't spend as much time on Unity as we wanted to, but we're already kind of like uh um a little bit past where we would like to be, especially since we had the late start. Um, do you want to play some Who Wants to be a Persuader?

SPEAKER_02

Dude, let's do it.

SPEAKER_04

All right. That sounds great.

SPEAKER_02

Last week I got to answer some questions. Do you want me to be asking you any questions today, or how do you go?

SPEAKER_04

Um, I could certainly um it's harder to do. I I could put stuff up there and then you could um however you want to.

SPEAKER_02

I mean, I'm I'm happy to answer some questions if you'd like to like no, I just decide.

SPEAKER_04

I think we gotta see what we could uh do, but maybe we'll do a round with you uh answering again if you don't mind, and then uh we'll do one where I and then we'll see if I can do it. Um all right, uh so this is for you, Steven. We're gonna start uh with this round here. Um it's the Unity Chapter one. Um, so I guess these questions are gonna be all about Unity. Um giving you a little weird tone.

SPEAKER_02

Uh no, I I can't hear it, but uh it's kind of blurry. I can't read I couldn't read the question on the screen.

SPEAKER_04

Okay, yes, I can hear it.

SPEAKER_02

Oh, I hear it. It's dinging now.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah. Do you hear it still? Still making a noise.

SPEAKER_02

Nope. Nope. It's and it's clear now. I can read the I can read the question. We heard something was being weird. Okay.

SPEAKER_04

Okay. But are you hearing like a ding ding-ding-ding sound? No longer. No, I'm not hearing anything. Well, as long as you aren't, then that's good. I don't know. It's in my ears, um, but it might just be because of um there's some test audio that I have created um as I'm starting to add real audio to this uh this game, and so it plays that test audio sometimes in a loop. Um that's no matter. Let's go ahead and get started here on who wants to be a persuader. Question number one in Chaldini's framework, Unity is strongest when people feel that they are sharing what? Um A a low price, B a limited deadline, C, a common identity, or D, a long speech.

SPEAKER_02

Question, and I think this was a question from last week. So I think I know the answer.

SPEAKER_04

Oh, we played this in our um before. Maybe I should give you a different round. How about we do that?

SPEAKER_02

There is that is that something that you can do? Oh, absolutely.

SPEAKER_04

I've got I've programmed in a whole I mean I'm at yeah. I um okay. This is actually of uh let's do this one. This is gonna be a round that is just uh the whole book. So it could be anything from from the book um by Mr. Cialdini here. So um, all right. So which principle of persuasion does this describe? Uh reciprocity.

SPEAKER_02

Um I think I know the answer.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, all right. Well, I wonder what that one is. Which principle of persuasion does this describe? Reciprocity? Uh that's a weird one. Um, but I'm gonna bet you that you're gonna go with social proof, okay. Yeah, no, no, come on. No, no, uh, it's gonna go for C. All right. Final answer. Of course it is, and he's right. That was a strange question, and I didn't vet all the questions uh before. Um, so that's my my bad. Next question though. Uh, which principle of persuasion? Oh, that's a weird one. That's almost like the first one. Let's try a different uh round of questions then because that's kind of fucked up. Um all right, start the round, start the questions. Oh, this is uh movie questions. You want to do some movie questions? Ooh, that could be fun.

SPEAKER_02

That could be I'm honestly I uh uh I used to go to like uh trivia nights and things like that. That I find that kind of stuff super fun, like general trivia.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, that would be fun. Um I guess that's probably not what we're here to do tonight. So um I'm gonna go ahead and shoot for some more unity questions because I think these will work here. So let's see what happens with these. All right, what is the central keyword of the Unity principle? Is it A only B now, C, we, or D more?

SPEAKER_02

I'm gonna go. I'm hearing the dinging, like the the the uh Yeah, isn't that annoying with it? The turn signal, but I'm gonna go with C. It uh Unity is the we is the something me. The greater me. Anyway, C.

SPEAKER_04

C. Okay. I'm gonna see if I can get rid of that dinging sound that's bugging us here.

SPEAKER_02

Sorry, yeah, I don't have to bring I don't have to say it every time I hear it, but I just uh figured I'd okay, it went away.

SPEAKER_04

Did it for you? It's still in my ear for some reason, but that's okay. As long as it's not in yours. You hear me? Yes, I can hear you. Okay. I wanted to make sure after turning it down that uh I wasn't cutting your audio too. So um it's kind of annoying for me too, but I'll get past it. So um, you're gonna go for C wee? All right, locking that final answer. We job, Steven, you made it. So here's the next question for you. A message beginning with as members of the same church is mainly using what price anchoring, scarcity, shared identity, or contrast.

SPEAKER_02

Let's go with the shared identity.

SPEAKER_04

Steve says shared identity, and that's your final church. Uses that one, yes, sir.

SPEAKER_03

Yes, sir.

SPEAKER_04

All right, shared identity is correct. All right, so Steven has moved his way up the ladder to a whole five cents. Uh, let's see how he does. So we'll move on to the next question here. Which statement is the most consistent with Unity? Is it A? This comes with a free sample, B, nine out of ten buyers agree. C, our people take care of one another, or D act fast before midnight.

SPEAKER_02

Uh, let's go with C our people take care of one another.

SPEAKER_04

Our people take care of one another. Are you sure? Yes, yes, I have lifelines available to you if you need them. I might save those. Save those for later. Dollar question. Yeah, so C is your final answer. And he's right. All right, next question: when someone highlights a shared heritage, they are trying to trigger what response is it a a feeling of same as me, B, a desire to reciprocate a gift, C, a fear of missing out, or D, a reaction to numerical contrast.

SPEAKER_02

Let's go with uh, I'm gonna guess a a feeling of same as me.

SPEAKER_04

Feeling of same as me, and that is your final answer, yes. All right, and he's right. Good job, Steven. You're making your way through. Now, the next question: which relationships most naturally support unity? Yeah, right. You're making big bucks here on Who Wants to be a Persuader. Which relationship most naturally supports Unity? Is it A Anonymous strangers with no overlap? B comping with bitter, C unrelated algorithms or D teammates.

SPEAKER_02

We gotta go with D teammates. I gotta Unity, I'd stick with my teammates.

SPEAKER_04

All right, and then that's your final answer. Final answer. All right, let's see. Drum roll, please. He's right. I have to laugh because suddenly, um, out of the woodworks, his cat has appeared. I didn't even know it was in the room with me.

SPEAKER_02

There's a cat, awesome. There's a cat show her later behind the green screen sleepy, but I haven't I'm surprised they haven't moved yet.

SPEAKER_04

Nice. All right. Well, let's see, Steven has made his way up to an entire 50 cents. Yes. See where he goes, see if he can make it all the way up to the 10 bucks grand prize if he does. Uh, what why might a college fundraiser mention that a caller is also an alumnus? Is it A to increase scarcity? B to create common identity with the donor, C to remove the need for a cause, or D to threaten the donor.

SPEAKER_02

We uh can I use a lifeline on this one of the 50-50 possible to is that a lifeline?

SPEAKER_04

Oh well, we do have the 50-50 lifeline available to use that uh you're wanting to use that? That one okay, computer take away two of the wrong answers. All right. That leaves us to create common identity or to threaten the donor. Which one do you think that is? Let's go with B. We create common identity. All right, I'm gonna assume that's your final answer. Final. All right, and he's right. All right, good job, Steven. Next question. Okay, which of these best illustrates the difference between unity and reciprocity? Is it A, Unity says we belong together, reciprocity says I owe you back, or B, unity says only today, reciprocity says experts approve. B unity says be consistent, reciprocity says be uncertain, or D unity says everyone is doing it, and reciprocity says act later.

SPEAKER_02

These questions are getting more involved. Uh I can sense that I'm gonna have to ask the crowd soon, but I think this one I'm gonna go with A. Uh the we belong together and I owe you back. But I can sense I'm gonna use the crowd once.

SPEAKER_04

Okay, uh, we're gonna lock that in as your final answer then.

SPEAKER_02

Lock it in.

SPEAKER_04

Okay, and And he's right. All right. Good job. Notice how things are uh moving along a lot nicer tonight than they were last week. Things seem to be a little more responsive. Yeah. Um, go ahead. A campaign appeals to fellow survivors rather than potential donors. Why is it A because it automatically proves expertise? B because it lowers printing costs, C because it eliminates audience choice, or D because shared lived experience can create stronger unity than a generic dot dot dot. Still gotta fix that dot dot dot issue.

SPEAKER_02

I do like those dot dot dot ones. They are you get to guess what the end of the answer is. Yeah, uh let's go with let's go with D. It because I know printing costs uh audience, uh and the the proves expertise. It could, you know, it could be that one. But I'm gonna go with D, even though I don't know the last word.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, let's go ahead and lock that in then. Um, and you say that's probably your final answer, then all right. Yes, sir. And he's right. Yeah, that was a good choice there. You didn't waste a lifeline on that one. All right, in practical persuasion, Unity often increases receptivity by changing the audience's answer to which question is it a is this font modern? B is this product heavier, C, is this chart longer? Or D, is this person one of us?

SPEAKER_02

Okay, I'm liking the fact that the D uses the word us. So uh let me read the question Receptivity. I would say uh let's go with D, but D? Let's go with D. Let's do it.

SPEAKER_04

Okay, D, he says, and that is his final answer. And is he right? Yes, he is right. Good job. All right, all right, Steven moving on up the ladder here. He's uh basically made an entire four bucks. Well, actually, you made three bucks and you're at the four dollar level. Don't screw up. Okay, yeah. Which appeal uses Unity most strongly? Is it A, as consumers everywhere, compare prices carefully? B this expert ranks first in the field, C, as neighbors on this block. Let's keep our streets safe. Or D, sale ends at noon.

SPEAKER_02

You know, I like the C uses let's keep our streets safe. And I feel like that's the most unified answer. So I'm gonna go with C.

SPEAKER_04

C is your final answer, then. Yes. All right, let's do it. We're gonna say C. He's right. All right, Steven, you're you're gonna have be uh the proud possessor of a ten dollar bill by the time this is over, so all right. Um, what makes um identity language persuasive beyond surface wording? Is it A, it guarantees factual accuracy, b, it always shortens the message, C, it can activate obligations, norms, and loyalties tied to group dot dot dot. Or D, it makes the audience forget consequences.

SPEAKER_02

I see, I see the word membership on my end, uh, but knowing that it gave it a dot dot dot, uh actually Oh, yeah, it is a membership.

SPEAKER_04

Uh, it's given me a slightly different view on my monitor here, but I see on a different screen here that it's showing membership. So C, it can activate obligations, norms, and loyalties tied to group membership.

SPEAKER_02

I I like I like that it gave it a dot dot dot, but also I like the membership thing. So I'm going with C.

SPEAKER_04

He's gonna go with C final answer. Final answer. All right, you're locked in. Right. Let's see.

unknown

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_04

Yay, you got it. All right, all right. And then the next question why can unity be stronger than appeals to popularity? Is it A, Unity works only in advertising? B popularity requires family ties, C, following our group can feel our safe. I'm gonna read that again. Following our group, in quotes, can feel more personally binding than following people. And wait, we're gonna have to fix dot dot dots, aren't we? And then D popularity never influences anyone.

SPEAKER_02

Well, I believe that D should be the answer, but it is not my answer. Um, let's see.

SPEAKER_03

Uh yeah, right.

SPEAKER_02

Uh now let's go. I'm gonna use the crowd one on the next one, no matter what. So I'm gonna go with C on this one and hoping that I make it to the next one. Okay.

SPEAKER_04

I'm gonna go with C. C. Following R group can feel more personally binding. That feels like the right answer, doesn't it?

SPEAKER_02

Like our group.

SPEAKER_04

R group, yeah. All right. Well, we're gonna go ahead and lock that in. And you're right! Good job.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04

Uh uh, which and we're uh I forgot to show the ladder here. I wonder if I I think I have within my controls a way of showing the ladder if we need to, but um where is that? I don't see it. All right, we'll just do it next time. Uh, which advanced persuasive tactic is the most consistent with Unity? Is it A using only technical jargon? B ignoring the audience's identity completely, C reducing all issues to price, or D linking the requested action to what members of the group stand for.

SPEAKER_02

I say we go to the crowd on this one. I would like to use my lifeline.

SPEAKER_04

You want to do the ask the audience lifeline? Is that correct?

SPEAKER_02

Yes, let's do it.

SPEAKER_04

All right, all right. So I'm going to go ahead and put 60 seconds on the clock uh here. And if people are uh um, I don't think it shows yet, so I'm gonna go and arm this poll. And you'll see on your screen here, folks, that there is a URL, vote.persuasion.club. Uh go there now, and you should get a little app that shows you um that we are about to take a vote to help Steven answer his question. So we're gonna give a couple more seconds here for people to kind of fire that up on their devices. And I think I will go ahead and start that countdown and we'll see how we do. We'll have to make some uh let me down. We'll have to make the music here. All right. We're voting now, audience. So here we go. Hopefully uh we have some folks that'll uh get in there and do some voting because if they don't, you're kind of hosed, right?

SPEAKER_02

Like lose your body ball and everything. I have to I need the crowds in point.

SPEAKER_04

Hey, we got one, we got one vote. We got a vote. Please do. So at least at least we'll have uh one one answer for you. Um you know, once people learn about all the fun that we have here on our show, playing Who Wants to be a Persuader, they're gonna flock before you know it. All right, we've got uh 15 seconds left in the voting here. Okay, and we will see down to the wire. Um but and we need that music. We just gotta dun dun dun dun dun d dun dun dun. Okay, so it looks like the audience has chosen um D. Um, so linking the requested action to what members of the group stand for. So what do you think, Steven? Okay, you're going for it?

SPEAKER_02

I am gonna go for D. Let's do it. Let's lock it in.

SPEAKER_04

Locking in that to find my answer, D. And dramatic outcome. Boom! Okay. All right. Once again, I forgot to do the uh uh the ladder there, so we'll just uh have to go along with that. I think you're up to like eight bucks or something like that. From a high-level psychological perspective, unity is potent because it narrows the boundary between which two things is it a self-interest and group interest? Is it B, color and sound, C, speed and volume, or D, form and margin?

SPEAKER_02

I am going to have to go with A or Steve says A, self-interest and group interest.

SPEAKER_04

And is that a reason? But I just it just feels just feels right. Nothing else to do. Okay, locking in, final answer. You ready? Uh he's right.

unknown

Woohoo! I see green.

SPEAKER_04

Yep. Okay, so now um I did it again. Um, missed the ladder. Come on here. Um 15.

SPEAKER_02

Question 15 might be the last one.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, this could that's right, it is the you're on the $10 question. So let's see if you can do it. Which description best captures a top-tier unity appeal? Is it a random coupon with no story? B a natural memo with no audience framing, C, a timer counting down on a website, or D, an invitation to act that makes refusal feel like betraying one's own people.

SPEAKER_02

Whoa. Okay. Well, I'm gonna have to go with betrayal. Uh, you don't want to ever betray your own people. That's one way to so that would be answer D. I'm gonna go with D.

SPEAKER_04

Yes.

SPEAKER_02

D final, final, final answer.

SPEAKER_04

Final, final answer. Okay. Well, let's see. Dramatic outcome. He's right. Awesome! He made it.

SPEAKER_02

I'm gonna make it rain.

SPEAKER_04

I'm gonna make it rain. Uh awesome. Well, that's uh that was uh a full round uh there, I think. That took uh what about 15-20 minutes. I don't know how you feel about going for another one or if we wanted to call that good uh for tonight. It's totally up to you.

SPEAKER_02

I think I think uh it might be getting late to do another one unless uh oh unless you want to like uh might get I might not be able to join the after show if it goes too much later. Well, I was almost thinking what we could do is we could wrap it up.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, we definitely so maybe we uh the way that it'll go is we'll just have to like flip back and forth each week, and you do one, then I do one the next week because that yeah, just playing the game um definitely uh could take a little time to get through a round, but you we learn a lot of good stuff, so yeah, that's really good.

SPEAKER_02

And I I don't want to be uh I feel like spoiled because I've been able to play twice now. So I uh next week we have to do a session. We do have to do a game where you answer all the questions.

SPEAKER_04

Absolutely, yeah. Um so we'll go ahead and uh call that good then, and um I think that that actually is a good place to to wrap up the show uh for the evening and then do an after show where we can just kind of hang out and chit-chat and uh have some fun. So um go ahead and move back to our dual view here. We don't need that other thing anymore. Yeah, yeah. Um I I think that we're we're getting better uh with the technology, we're getting better at uh making uh things a little bit exciting and fun for everybody. Um, and we're just gonna keep doing that, getting better um is is our goal. Um, but as we mentioned, this actually wraps us up for the the book Influence by Robert Chaldini. And so we don't have a next book picked out. Yeah, right. Kudos to us. Uh our commitment and consistency. We we we we stuck to it. Um we did have a couple of weeks where we we took a little bit of a break, but uh we were back at it. Um and so I think that uh yeah, definitely kudos to us and kudos to our uh P1s, as they call them, I guess, uh are the fans and the folks that uh start off with a show. So if you are watching this show um and uh becoming a fan of Persuasion Club, you are our uh very first people, our fans. So we appreciate you coming along for the ride. So appreciate it. Yeah, yeah, thank you. Yeah, all righty. Then we'll go ahead and um go out for the night here and um do the after show after that. So thanks for joining us, and we'll we'll get to talking about our next book uh soon. We'll probably put a poll online uh and maybe we'll talk about uh some ideas in the after show as well. So good night, everybody.

SPEAKER_02

That's good, good night, everybody. Thank you.

SPEAKER_04

Oh, great show. Um, you know, I started to play um the music here and I had turned it down because of that beep, beep, beep thing that we were getting. So uh let's see if see if I can make this play now. Um yeah, I had to turn the volume down because it was making all kinds of crazy noise. So uh that uh exit, that fancy exit that I was hoping to do with everybody didn't sound as fancy as I meant it to be. So here we go. This that's ought to work here. And and no, and no, it's not gonna work. There we go.

SPEAKER_00

I can hear it.

SPEAKER_04

Good night, everybody.

unknown

Good night.

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Kevin

Host
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Steven

Host

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